Comments on: The Time Changer http://rosecreekvillage.com/shammah/archives/18 Practical, effective, tested, and wholehearted Christianity Tue, 31 Jan 2012 15:06:50 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Benjamin http://rosecreekvillage.com/shammah/archives/18/comment-page-1#comment-56 Benjamin Thu, 03 Jul 2008 20:53:37 +0000 http://rosecreekvillage.com/shammah/?p=18#comment-56 Thanks again for pouring your heart out! It was awesome to see you and am always filled to the brim! LET THE LORD ARISE AND LET HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED! Thanks again for pouring your heart out! It was awesome to see you and am always filled to the brim!
LET THE LORD ARISE AND LET HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED!

]]> By: Kim Anderson http://rosecreekvillage.com/shammah/archives/18/comment-page-1#comment-55 Kim Anderson Tue, 01 Jul 2008 20:10:03 +0000 http://rosecreekvillage.com/shammah/?p=18#comment-55 This is good to hear. I've never tried to not dichotomize it. The simplifies things greatly. Thanks! You just have no idea. I feel so free now. This is good to hear. I’ve never tried to not dichotomize it. The simplifies things greatly. Thanks! You just have no idea. I feel so free now.

]]> By: Beth http://rosecreekvillage.com/shammah/archives/18/comment-page-1#comment-54 Beth Sat, 28 Jun 2008 20:20:51 +0000 http://rosecreekvillage.com/shammah/?p=18#comment-54 Hey Shammah, That was great. It was very encouraging to read. Thank you for the time you take to get these things written. Miss you and love you! Hey Shammah,

That was great. It was very encouraging to read. Thank you for the time you take to get these things written. Miss you and love you!

]]> By: Shammah http://rosecreekvillage.com/shammah/archives/18/comment-page-1#comment-52 Shammah Fri, 27 Jun 2008 03:50:12 +0000 http://rosecreekvillage.com/shammah/?p=18#comment-52 Hi Kim. I don't think it's either or; I think it's both. Paul says of himself that he disciplines his body and brings it under subjection out of fear of being disqualified (1 Cor. 9:27). However, he also talks about Christ dwelling in our hearts by faith, being rooted and grounded in love, and knowing the love of Christ so that we'd be filled with the fullness of God (Eph. 3:17-19). It's God who works in us both to will and to do of his good pleasure (Php. 2:13), but we, like Paul, should "strive according to his working, which works in me" (Col. 1:29). Peter commands us to conduct ourselves in fear (1 Pet. 1:17). John says perfect love casts out fear (1 Jn. 4:18). It's not either or, it's both. It might be nice if we were totally selfless, never thinking of rewards, but there's no command to be that way, nor any examples of people that are that way. Even Christ himself overcame "for the joy that was set before him." He was abundant in the use of threats of punishment and promises of rewards along with his commands. You may struggle with accountability being a motivation, but the fact is that we humans need accountability, and it will always be part of our motivation. We can dream about being such wonderful beings that accountability is unnecessary, and maybe such people exist. Jesus and the apostles don't seem to address those people, though. They address weak people like ourselves who need the grace of God, each other, our efforts, our gratefulness, God's mercy, and God's threatenings and punishments in order to live lives pleasing to God. Hi Kim. I don’t think it’s either or; I think it’s both. Paul says of himself that he disciplines his body and brings it under subjection out of fear of being disqualified (1 Cor. 9:27). However, he also talks about Christ dwelling in our hearts by faith, being rooted and grounded in love, and knowing the love of Christ so that we’d be filled with the fullness of God (Eph. 3:17-19). It’s God who works in us both to will and to do of his good pleasure (Php. 2:13), but we, like Paul, should “strive according to his working, which works in me” (Col. 1:29).

Peter commands us to conduct ourselves in fear (1 Pet. 1:17). John says perfect love casts out fear (1 Jn. 4:18). It’s not either or, it’s both. It might be nice if we were totally selfless, never thinking of rewards, but there’s no command to be that way, nor any examples of people that are that way. Even Christ himself overcame “for the joy that was set before him.” He was abundant in the use of threats of punishment and promises of rewards along with his commands.

You may struggle with accountability being a motivation, but the fact is that we humans need accountability, and it will always be part of our motivation. We can dream about being such wonderful beings that accountability is unnecessary, and maybe such people exist. Jesus and the apostles don’t seem to address those people, though. They address weak people like ourselves who need the grace of God, each other, our efforts, our gratefulness, God’s mercy, and God’s threatenings and punishments in order to live lives pleasing to God.

]]> By: Kim Anderson http://rosecreekvillage.com/shammah/archives/18/comment-page-1#comment-51 Kim Anderson Thu, 26 Jun 2008 21:32:48 +0000 http://rosecreekvillage.com/shammah/?p=18#comment-51 Hey Shammah! Great post. I still struggle with this idea. It's not that I don't come to the same end (I think) but the means are different. I've always understood that the works are an outpouring of God working through you. You can choose to force the works...pull yourself up by your bootstraps and do what you are "supposed" to do OR, you can allow having Christ in you and in those around you to transform you in such a way that those good works pour out of your joyful heart rather than a heart obligated by guilt or fear of disappointing those around you. I do think our works are something we will be held accountable for but I struggle with that fact being the motivation. It's as if we are motivated to do good by our hope of something for ourselves rather than being compelled by Love. So, now I've said it. I think I either don't understand your view on works or we think the same things and I just say it differently. If we are supposed to make ourselves do it rather than let it happen in us, I'd really like to know because that's what I did as a young follower but I was turned on to this idea of "being" rather than "doing" and I haven't quiet know what to be or do since. I haven't wanted to ask on Tuesday night because, well, I kind of feel like an idiot for not understanding. So, it's out now. Will you please enlighten this idiot? Kim Hey Shammah! Great post. I still struggle with this idea. It’s not that I don’t come to the same end (I think) but the means are different. I’ve always understood that the works are an outpouring of God working through you. You can choose to force the works…pull yourself up by your bootstraps and do what you are “supposed” to do OR, you can allow having Christ in you and in those around you to transform you in such a way that those good works pour out of your joyful heart rather than a heart obligated by guilt or fear of disappointing those around you. I do think our works are something we will be held accountable for but I struggle with that fact being the motivation. It’s as if we are motivated to do good by our hope of something for ourselves rather than being compelled by Love.

So, now I’ve said it. I think I either don’t understand your view on works or we think the same things and I just say it differently. If we are supposed to make ourselves do it rather than let it happen in us, I’d really like to know because that’s what I did as a young follower but I was turned on to this idea of “being” rather than “doing” and I haven’t quiet know what to be or do since. I haven’t wanted to ask on Tuesday night because, well, I kind of feel like an idiot for not understanding. So, it’s out now. Will you please enlighten this idiot?

Kim

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